Love can show up in our lives in different shapes and forms. There’s platonic love, familial love and romantic love. All these forms of love are of equal importance and can be found in abundance! This episode of Real Stories MKE will focus on love stories told by Pam Grandy, Russ Kafka and Alexis Outlaw. The episode is hosted by Kim Shine and Joel Dresang and edited by Sam Woods.
Episode transcript below from Ex Fabula's Real Storie MKE series.
Joel Dresang: Welcome to Real Stories MKE, brought to you as part of Ex Fabula’s work to connect Milwaukee through real stories. I'm Joel Dresang.
Kim Shine: And I am Kim Shine. Everybody has personal stories worth sharing. Ex Fabula hosts storytelling workshops where community members can build their skills and also their confidence. And Ex Fabula also has slams where true stories- they're shared on stage. And so today we're bringing you three of those powerful stories.
Joel Dresang: And Kim, our theme and this episode is love. Yeah. Love is an experience that bonds us. It can be felt in different capacities. It can teach us about ourselves and others. Sometimes love can border on obsession. And that's in this episode, anyway, a healthy obsession. That's true. And love doesn't always last. But it's real. And it's always changing us.
Kim Shine: It is man. I have many stories about love and loss and oh my goodness, we could share those. But we are going to talk about Beyoncé.
Joel Dresang: Yes, we are.
Kim Shine: And a boomerang kind of love. The teen crush kind. And also the one that got away.
Joel Dresang: Yes. Yeah. Well, got away and then came back.
Kim Shine: That's true.
Joel Dresang: That's right. Yeah. Okay. So, our first love story is about how sometimes dreams come true, and it comes from Pam Grandy, who told her story at a 2017 Ex Fabula StorySlam with the theme risking it. Here's Pam.
Pam Grandy: When I was in seventh grade, I had a dream that would eventually change my life. I dreamt that I was walking out of my junior high, arm in arm with a boy, and I remember we both had jean jackets on and jeans, and we each had one hand in each other's back pocket. Now, in real life, with this time, I had never had a boyfriend yet, but I figure if I have my hand in this guy's back pocket and vice versa, he must be my boyfriend.
So, I was. I looked up at him to see who this guy is, but it was- My vision was fuzzy. I didn't know who it was. So, we walked down the street a little bit, and we came to this little outside market, and we were looking around and a minute later I saw that my mom was there too.
And I knew that if my mom saw me with a boy, I would be in big trouble. So Mystery Boy and I split up and pretended we weren't there together. And that was it. That was my dream. I woke up when I woke up from this dream. I had this really warm, fuzzy feeling about it. And I remembered every little detail of it except I could not figure out who this boy was.
So, the next time that I was in school, I was in my first class of the day, which was band, and I was sitting there with my flute waiting for practice to start, and I looked up at the drummers and I saw Kenny. Now, I have seen him before because I had band like, every day. But today when I looked at Kenny, it was different.
I had that same warm, fuzzy feeling that I had had when I woke up from my dream and I knew an instant that Kenny was “mystery boy”. He was the one who was in my dream. So I looked at him more and thought, he's pretty cute. So there started my crush on Kenny. Now he was a year ahead of me and he was a really friendly, outgoing guy, a little mischievous at times, and I was more quiet and shy and a very follow the rules kind of girl.
So, I thought, there is no way that Kenny would ever even look at me, you know, much less like and want to date me. But I was okay with this. I was okay having a crush and admiring him from afar, you know, following him in the hall and watching him walk between classes and being in band and trying to catch a look at him, but not get caught and not have him catch me looking at him.
And I was okay with this. All through junior high and high school, he was just my crush. And in the meantime, I did actually get a real boyfriend. More on that in a minute. So that was junior high and high school. Fast forward about three years. It was the senior year or that was the summer before my senior year of college, and it was about a week before I was going back to Whitewater, and my friend Gretchen caught me and she said, “Pam, you will never guess who was at my house yesterday!”
“I don't know who was at your house yesterday?” “Kenny was at my house.” Turns out that Kenny was really good friends with Gretchen's boyfriend at the time, Michael. So they were all at Gretchen's house, and they were just hanging out, and they were looking at old pictures, and I was in a lot of those pictures because Gretchen and I have been friends since we were kids.
And I guess Kenny saw the pictures and he remembered me. He knew who I was and he asked about me, and Gretchen said, “Pam, I had to tell him that you had had a crush on him.” Now, if she had told me that in high school that she had told him that, I would have been mortified. But now I'm like, oh, okay, sure.
Why not? And, well, she said, you know, “...he asked about you and he wants us all to hang out.” Now here comes my first dilemma and risk. Remember that boyfriend I was talking about? Yeah. Well, I was still dating him at the time, but the relationship was up and down. Off and on. But nonetheless, I did have a boyfriend at the time.
And usually me being the follow the rules kind of girl I never would even dream of, you know, hanging out with another guy when I had a boyfriend. But I told myself this was different. A. the relationship I was in wasn't that great. And B. we're talking about Kenny here. You know, I finally had a chance to find out what this guy was really like.
Because, you know, when you have a crush on someone, you kind of put him on a pedestal. And I thought, well, let's find out what this guy is really like. You know, maybe... maybe he's a jerk. Maybe he's not cute anymore. Maybe he got fat. Who knows? So, I told my boyfriend that I was hanging out with Gretchen the next night, which wasn't a lie.
I was hanging out with- She was there. So, the four of us went out and we went for pizza, and we went mini golfing and Kenny was still gorgeous. And he was still really friendly, really nice. I had a really nice time, but nothing came of it from there. I did feel a bit guilty and I was going back to college, so that was it.
Nothing happened after that with Kenny. Now fast forward another three years or so. The boyfriend who had since then become the fiancé. A whole ‘nother story. Finally, in the summer of 1995, he became the ex-fiancée. Thank God. Another story. So, you know. So, then this was the summer of ‘95. And the next couple of months, I was getting used to being single again.
And I just kept thinking about Kenny, and I thought I just. I guess I decided that if I saw him somewhere Summerfest or Grant Park or something, I would go talk to him. And, that didn't happen. I didn't see him, but I just could not stop thinking about him. And by that time, it was getting close to Christmas, and I thought, I really I didn't think I could just get his number and call him, like, I was too terrified to do that.
But I thought it was getting close to Christmas. Maybe I can send a Christmas card. So I looked him up in the phone book. For those of you who are- who don't know what a phone book is: It's an actual book that you have to turn the pages to find a name and address and phone number. And I found that he was living on the east side of Milwaukee.
I didn't know if he had a girlfriend or a fiancé, or if he was getting married the next week. But I just felt like I need to do this. So, I found a nice little card, and I put a nice little message in there with my phone number, and I put it in the mail, for the next week or so after that, every time the phone rang, I’d pick it up.
“Hello?” Well, it wasn't him, and it wasn't him. And it wasn't him. You know, going about a week, week and a half or something like, okay, who am I kidding? He's not going to call me. I'm sure he's not a guy like that. He's got a girlfriend. He might even, you know, be married already. So, I kind of put it out of my mind and thought, okay, well, that's it he's not...
I tried and he's not gonna call me. So just when I was kind of had my guard down and was getting my hopes up. I had a terrible day; substitute teaching one day. And when I got home, I just fell asleep on the couch. And about 6:00, the phone rang, woke me up. So I went to the phone, answered the phone.
I was like, “hello?” I heard, “Pam?” “Yeah?” “Hey, this is Kenny.” Okay, so it's Kenny. So, on the outside, I'm trying to be really cool and casual in my voice. Like, “hey, how's it going? What's going on?” And the inside, I was like, oh my god it's Kenny! So, And even while I was talking to him, I thought, well, he's going to tell me that, you know, “thanks for the Christmas card, but I'm getting married next week.
And please don't ever bother me again.” But he didn't. We talked for a couple of minutes and he's like, “hey, we should go out.” And I was like,” well, yes, yes we should.” So ,we did. And we made plans to go out and a couple of days later and we went to a movie and had our first date, and that dream that I had had, which turned into the crush, which turned into the first date, turned into the relationship and turned into my husband and the love of my life.
That was Pam Grandy. She told that story about three years after her husband Kenny had passed away, and we have this update from her. She says “a few months after Kenny died, I had another dream about him. In it, he looked healthy and gorgeous, almost glowing. I realized in the dream that we both knew that he had died.”
Joel Dresang: “So, I asked him if he missed me. He said, ‘no. I'm with you all the time.’ To this day, I truly believe that he and his love are always with me and our kids as we move forward in this life.”
Kim Shine: That is very precious.
Joel Dresang: I hope that's comforting to her.
Kim Shine: Yeah, I love that. That's so great. It also tells you the power of love or shows you the power of love. It transcends and you know, it's just great.
Joel Dresang: It lasts...
Kim Shine: Well, our next story comes from Russ Kafka. Russ shared this story in May of 2022 at All Stars. Here's Russ.
Russ Kafka: Good evening. Thank you very much. My story starts over 40 years ago. I'm 32 years old. I've got a good job here in Milwaukee. I'm dating. Got good social life. I'm really liking being single. You know, a good friend of mine arranged a blind date, a tennis stage with one of her coworkers, Carrie and I thinking,
Okay. Tennis is not my forte, but I agreed. So, I was at the tennis court at the agreed upon time, and Carrie drives up in her car and opens a door and out steps this gorgeous woman wearing this beautiful white short tennis dress, white tennis shoes. Me? I'm in a t-shirt, workout shorts and sneakers. I'm thinking “I'm sunk.”
This isn't going anywhere. Here is a serious tennis player. And I'm lucky if I can get the serve over the net, much less maintain a volley. So, we started and guess what? She couldn't play tennis any better than I could. So, after a lot of net serves and chasing out-of-bounds balls, we decided to call it quits. Go to a bar and have a beer and talk and get to know each other a little bit.
Well, I liked her, so I started dating her and that's when she introduced me to her darling three-year-old daughter from her former marriage. Megan. Megan, with these big, expressive blue eyes, beaming smile and infectious laugh. Oh, man. It was terrific. She also introduced me to Admiral Bird, Carrie's pet Amazon parrot. Big green guy. He was a beautiful specimen.
Very smart. He hated men. So, I had to stay back from Admiral's cage because he'd attack when I go out and I'd say, “hello, Admiral Bird.” And his response was, “Up yours!” That was one of his favorite sayings. Who taught him? I don't know, but he did use it at the most inappropriate times. I continued dating Carrie and got to know her better.
And there are so many things I grew to like about her. She was spontaneous. She was like, “come on, try it. You’ll like it!” She was a great cook, introducing me to all these different kinds of exotic foods, recipes she'd dig out and say, let's try this. She was a great mother for Megan. And she loved to dance and was a great dance partner.
And I got- Megan and I got to know and like each other, too. She let me do kids stuff with her at Halloween. I borrowed a big bird costume, and she wore a mouse costume that Carrie had made for her. And we went trick or treating in the neighborhood. And when she got back, she shared some of her treats with me.
And on warm summer days, warm, rainy summer days, we would put on our swimsuits and Meagan and I would go out and build little dams out of sticks and pebbles and leaves in the gutter to keep the flowing- to dam up the flowing water. And then we'd float toy boats and the little lakes. We created. So this relationship went on for a number of months.
And finally, Carrie appropriately said, “hey, where is this going? I'm looking for a serious commitment here for me and for my daughter.” I got cold feet. I wasn't ready for that responsibility. So I stopped dating her for over a year. I dated socially. I didn't contact her until the winter. There was a group ski trip to the Upper Peninsula, and a mutual friend convinced Carrie to come along, knowing full well that I would be there.
It was a very awkward weekend for both of us. We hardly socialize together at all. Yet my seeing her made me step back and say, “Russ, you big dunce. You love her. You miss her spontaneity. That adds so much to your organized life. You miss the good times we had together. You miss dancing with her. You miss her can do attitude.”
“And guess what? You really miss Megan too and want to be a part of her life.” So on the ski trip. On the bus trip back, I sat with her and I told her how I felt and I was ready and asked if she would see me again. She was a little hesitant, not knowing whether I was going to take off again and not see her again, but she agreed.
Guess what? Two months later, we were engaged. In the fall we bought a house together and moved in. And in the winter we got married and became a family. Now, music was a very big part of our lives in that house. I played the piano I had since I was five years old. Megan love to sing and dance, Megan took tap dance lessons and ballet and modern dance.
And I remember how proud I felt being in the audience of all those recitals. Yeah, there were a lot of them. And, you know, Carey decided that she was going to take up an instrument, too. Now, she'll admit she didn't come from a musical background. So why did she decide to learn how to play one of the hardest instruments there was to play? The Scottish bagpipes.
Now bagpipes. You either like them or you don't like them. Luckily, I like them. I love the skirl of the mournful tones. But bagpipes are best appreciated outdoors. So I knew when I came- drive home from work into the garage, I could tell Carey was practicing. The walls were throbbing and the house- and the music is coming out.
I'd walk into the kitchen and Carey was marching around playing her pipes. Admiral Byrd was screeching at the top of his lungs. The dog was under the table whining and barking, and the cats were mewling from- I don't know where it was! It was quite a raucous concert. However, I have wonderful memories of watching Carrie march with her bagpipe band for many local parades in the summer.
But my most vivid memory is her playing amazing Grace. At the gravesite of my father's burial. There wasn't a dry eye. And you know, over the years, I got to see Megan through a combination of nature and nurture, blossom and become a beautiful, caring, loving, talented, intelligent and, yes, independent woman. Thank you.
Kim Shine: That was Russ Kafka, and he gave us this update. Russ says “I'm still a proud, Ex Fabula member, along with my wife, daughter and her wife. We enjoy attending the slams and hearing stories from members of the various communities that Ex Fabula serves. Stories help build connections, and those connections help to bring diverse communities together. We hope that Ex Fabula will continue to provide a platform for more storytellers.”
Joel Dresang: Hey Kim, how about doing some Ultrashorts?
Kim Shine: I think that'd be fine.
Joel Dresang: Okay. Ultrashorts again, are little, tiny stories that people at our events write on a slip of paper and the host reads them on stage. And we've got a couple here with the theme love. This one is from anonymous. “Who knew my husband was gay? Not our family or friends. Not our kids. And definitely not me.
After he told me and I got over the shock of our world turning upside down, he was taking his first steps into his new life. I could see he was free and truly himself for the first time. Today he's more beautiful than ever. I still love him, but just in a different way.”
Kim Shine: That is really nice. And this one. This person did not leave a name either. Says “Fostering a child. Wow. It's scary. You are responsible for another human being. From fear comes awakening, joy, growth and boundless love.”
Our final love story, comes-
Kim Shine: Which i’m really excited about!
Joel Dresang: Okay. And it's from Alexis Outlaw. And she shared this story in 2023 at an After Dark: For the Culture StorySlam, which is a collaboration between Ex Fabula and Hyfin, Radio Milwaukee's urban alternative station. Here is Alexis.
Alexis Outlaw: All right, friends. So, because tonight's conversations are all about the culture, we definitely have to talk about the subculture that I know you all know about very well. Beyonce!
Okay, so let me ask you. All right. Here, right now, who's seen the Renaissance? Look at that. Okay, so I'm not a mathematician. I'm a business major, but that's at least 20% of the room. Do the figure on the tickets $500. Like. Okay. So I say all that to say that. Well, I didn't attend the Renaissance. I can tell you the reason why.
So, I'm going to tell you all a story about how I was once upon a time, the plus size Beyonce. Okay, so you heard my name. It's Alexis outlaw. That's my maiden name. Shout out to the outlaw. That's just a really cool name. Let's be forreal! But for a stretch, I had the honor and privilege of being a married woman.
And when I married, the person that I did, my name changed from Alexis Outlaw to Alexis Carter. All right? So, if anybody knows Beyonce, Beyoncé Knowles, what's her last name? Carter. All right, so that was one. That's when I realized, like, okay, I'm a Carter. All right. That makes sense. So, we'll talk a little zodiac real quick. any Capricorns in the house?
Oh my gosh. All right, shout out to my bestie Monique over there. 7/11 January 7th I am a Capricorn, and if you know anything about, Beyonce, January 7th is also the birthday of her daughter named Blue Ivy. Okay, so that was two. I was like, oh my gosh, me and her had the same birthday. I was born before blue Ivy, but nonetheless, we are akin because I am the plus size Beyonce.
Okay, so then 3. my former mother-in-law, who still my mama, I love her. That's why I love that lady. But her birthday was 12/4, which is the same day as Jay-Z, who is Beyonce's husband's birthday. So, I'm saying when we talk about numeric metrics like all those things culminating together, I'm like, fuck, I'm pretty much Beyonce, right?
So, all those things are happening, as I mentioned, you know, adding to the Beyoncé feels. And then I had the honor and pleasure of my first-time seeing Beyonce because y'all, I done seen Beyonce four times. But listen, I told you I didn't. I that Renaissance I asked you about, I didn't see. So let me explain. So seen Beyoncé four times.
And the first time I seen her, it was the Mrs. Carter World tour. And I'm like, I’m Miss Carter. She's Miss Carter. Let's do this. All right. However, when I went and saw the first time, it was, the nosebleed seats that were, like, real cheap at the top of Soldier Field to the point of the wind was blowing, and I was shaking, too.
But I was like, who cares? Beyonce... I'll die! But I had the opportunity to for that first time, I've seen Beyonce realize that, man, if you get in front of that woman, it's over. So first time seeing her, way at the top. The second time seeing Beyonce was On the Run One, in which I went with a former best friend.
And I need you to know this was when- no, no that was Formation! This was when she had made the announcement. It was her an Jay-Z. I went and it was everything all right. This was Beyonce two, Beyonce three. At the time my husband was like, “Look, girl, every time Beyoncé does something, you're trippin. You're trying to be her.
You what? You're like, you're obsessed.” Like, you know, it's it's getting out of hand. So I decided for his birthday to buy tickets to see Beyonce. And so we flew to Michigan because they didn't have any Chicago tickets. We flew to Michigan, stayed overnight, and I said it was for his birthday, but it was really for me because I was the Beyonce crack addict!
So we go, we see her. And honestly, he admitted she is magic. Beyonce is phenomenal. He really was like, “whoa, like I can kind of see why you're on the sauce. Like she did that” and he actually said, because Jay-Z is his favorite rapper. He said, “like, dude, I thought I was there for Jay, but I really was there for Bey.”
And so I said, you get it, right? Look, I heard a clap. He said, yeah, we was there for Bey. Okay, so that was Beyoncé three. All right. So I need you to know that in my Beyonce-ness, I realized that there was a problem when I went to go see Beyoncé for the fourth time, in which she did the Formation.
So, remember when she was on the Super Bowl, y'all? And then it ended and it went black, and then she was like, “world tour!” That was me. And I literally instantly got on my phone, bought tickets, didn't matter. $500 each ticket for Formation don't care. Right. So, I'm at Formation. Beyonce has an hour and a half late and this is actually the night Prince died.
So, I got to watch Beyoncé sing Purple Rain in the rain and I was like, this is happening. But before that happens, she comes out in formation. You remember, her song. Anyways, I'm standing there, we're waiting for her to come out and next thing I hear is dun dun- dun- dun dun- dun. And I realized the second she did that and I heard that music, I put my hands in the air and I was like, “Beyonce, say whatever you want from me...
You can HAAAVE!” Like all that creepy stuff they say about celebrities like, you know, that they're part of the Illuminati and all that stuff. When I realized that I was willing to 1. I spent $500 on Beyonce. She could have my checking account. I was telling people I was her- the bigger version, and I was obsessed.
But something about when that music went on and I realized that she could have my livelihood. I said, I don't think I can do Beyonce no more. And so I stopped being the plus size Miss Carter, I am no longer with the person anymore. I'm back to being an outlaw. And while my run as the plus size Beyonce was super fun, I will say this.
When we talk about a culture, sometimes you can get obsessed with such. And I'm actually proud of myself because I realized I was on the Beyoncé teat a little too hard. And that is my story. Thank You.
Joel Dresang: That was Alexis Outlaw. That After Dark: For the Culture event was part of Ex Fabula’s Brave Space project, which receives funding from the Milwaukee County Office of Equity, the Hertzfeld Foundation, the Heil Family Foundation, Wisconsin Humanities and Ex Fabula’s members. And we'd like to send some love to all those funders for creating those Brave Spaces for storytelling.
Kim Shine: Yeah, and thank you guys so much for supporting that project again. So much gratitude comes from me, Alea, everybody who was always there.
Joel Dresang: Kim, that's all the time we have for this episode of Real Stories MKE, but don't worry, because Ex Fabula has been at this since 2009, so there are plenty more audio and video stories available at exfabula.org.
Kim Shine: You know, that's a really long time. A really long time. I think. I was in undergrad back in 2009, but the Ex Fabula website lists upcoming storytelling workshops and slams, and we do hope that you will join us at an event and maybe get on stage and share a story or an Ultrashort. You can also connect with Ex Fabula on Facebook, Instagram and TikTok, and you can catch more episodes of Real Stories MKE wherever you get your podcasts.
Joel Dresang: Thanks to everyone who makes this program possible, including Ex Fabula staff, the storytellers, producer JJ Draper, and of course, audio engineer Sam Woods.
Kim Shine: Yeah, we love you, Sam. For Real Stories MKE, I'm Kim Shine.
Joel Dresang: And I'm Joel Dresang, remember, everyone's got a story to tell. Let's hear yours.
