Wednesday 6/24/26: Giannis' immigrant journey, 'Summertime' through the times, Summerfest week two preview

Rachel Owens: Support for WUWM podcasts comes from Bliffert Lumber, family owned and operated for over 120 years. Bliffert serves contractors and homeowners across Milwaukee and southeastern Wisconsin. Learn more at bliffertlumber.com.

Joy Powers: From 89.7 WUWM, Milwaukee's NPR, this is Lake Effect. I'm Joy Powers. Milwaukee Bucks star Giannis Antetokounmpo is leaving Milwaukee. Today we'll learn about his immigration story from Nigeria to Greece to the Cream City. Then we'll explore the many versions of the iconic song, "Summertime."

Dave Wake: It's these great, iconic American woman singers that very much define the song. It's got this quality of your mother singing it to you, like a lullaby.

Joy Powers: Plus, our friends at Radio Milwaukee share their recommendations for Week 2 of Summerfest.

Element Everest-Blanks: She is a fun artist to watch. She is like going to an actual show. It's not a recording artist coming to your city to perform. She is performer. So you gotta be in the building for Sudan Archives.

Joy Powers: All of that is coming up on Lake Effect. This is Lake Effect from 89.7 WUWM, Milwaukee's NPR. I'm Joy Powers, and thank you so much for joining us. Giannis Antetokounmpo is leaving Milwaukee. The Bucks star has been traded to the Miami Heat. The "Greek Freak" has been with the Bucks since 2013, and helped lead the team to an NBA championship in 2021. While his time in Milwaukee is coming to a close, today we're going to explore how he came to live in the U.S. and Milwaukee. Giannis migrated from Nigeria to Greece, then to the U S. After the legendary Game 6 in 2021, Giannis said this at the press conference.

Giannis Antetokounmpo: I give people around the world, from Africa, from Europe, give them hope that it can be done. It can be done. Eight years ago, eight and a half years ago, if I came to the league, I didn't know where my next meal would come from. My mom was selling stuff in the street. And now I'm here sitting in the top of the top.

Joy Powers: Ermitte Saint Jacques is an assistant professor in the Department of African and African Diaspora Studies at UWM. In 2021, she spoke with former Lake Effect producer, Mallory Cheng about Giannis' immigration story.

Mallory Cheng: What does the process of migrating from West Africa to Southern Europe look like in current day?

Ermitte Saint Jacques: In current day, it's precarious migration. And I say that because there are few legal avenues for migration. Lots of the migration is undocumented, unauthorized. Many potential migrants go through a long journey, especially going through the Sahara desert. People are at risk of getting smuggled, trafficked, etc. So it is dangerous now. However, that transformed. The time Giannis' parents migrated to Greece in the mid-1990s, it was still easy to come into Southern Europe. I'm not sure about his parents' background in terms of how they got to Greece, but usually you can come legally through a tourist visa and overstay your visa or a business visa. You can come in unauthorized through North Africa, go through Turkey and get into Greece. Or you can come through with false documents. So there are different ways of coming. One thing I wanna say before I begin about Southern Europe, many of these countries were emigration countries. These were the poorer countries of Europe, and people would leave those countries looking for better opportunities in Northern Europe. What happens with the European community in the mid 1980s is a transformation of the economies of Southern Europe. You have a large tourism industry that demands service sector workers. You have agriculture that also demands labor. You have northern Europeans who come to retire, who also need domestic service types of labor fulfilled. And so there is a demand for immigrant labor. And when I'm talking, I'm really talking about economic migrants. I'm not talking about refugees, because that's a whole different story in terms of their rights, etc., to enter a country, etc., compared to economic immigrants. One of the issues is the economic recession in 2008. That impacted a lot of the Southern European countries. And so when I think of Giannis, and thinking about him as a teenager, this was around the time where anti-immigrant sentiment is happening because of this recession, right? When people are out of work, you know, there's economic crisis, we usually scapegoat the immigrants. It's the immigrants' fault that we're having this situation. And in reality, the immigrants are doing the work that many natives don't want to do. People are looking for livelihood. People are looking for opportunity. And where they can get that, that's where they're going to go.

Mallory Cheng: So in the United States, we generally think about Europe being homogeneous. If you're Italian, you are a white Italian person. If you are Greek, you're a white Greek person. But we generally don't think of those places as diverse, non-homogeneous places. With people who are not white, who are immigrating to Southern Europe, such as Western Africans into Southern Europe, what does life look like and what does the process of citizenship look like?

Ermitte Saint Jacques: Life is, I would say, precarious, because you don't have steady work. You're in the informal economy and you're not... No one's paying your social security, etc. So you are very marginal. I think on our end in the US, when we look at Europe, we see homogenous, right? But these are not homogenous communities. Italy especially, you know, there are tensions between, or cultural differences between Northern Italians and Southern Italians, you know? So these aren't homogenous communities, especially thinking about Spain, thinking about Catalonia. But the thing is that most European countries don't have birthright citizenship. So if you are born in the country, but your parents are not citizens, you are not a citizen. On the one hand, with Giannis and his family, if he wasn't granted Greek citizenship, his parents could have probably applied for Nigerian citizenship for him. What that does though, parents are reluctant to do that because that might close the door on his eligibility to get Greek citizenship. Technically, many children of immigrants born in many European countries don't have citizenship. They are stateless just because they, you know, they don't a country of citizenship. Giannis is lucky in the sense of, you know, here's a super talented person. And I think the Greeks didn't want to lose out on having someone represent them, right? He's an amazing, fantastic person. But I think, the thing is you have to be exceptional in a way, unfortunately, for citizenship.

Mallory Cheng: And I think about it in the context of the United States where there's some parallels there, I would say. Now I'm just going to narrow it in a little bit. According to census data, the state of Wisconsin is approximately 85% white. So I just want to ask, what is the social significance of Giannis, who is a Nigerian Greek now living in Wisconsin, who is the face of the Milwaukee Bucks? What does that message mean now?

Ermitte Saint Jacques: I think it speaks to the complexity of identity. As you mentioned earlier, when you think about Greece, you don't think about Africans, but you have Africans who are Greek citizens. You have second generation children, right? The children who are born and raised, just like Giannis, who speak fluent Greek, right? Who can flow between their, you know, Yoruba or Igbo culture to the Greek culture, etc. I think it challenges us to think about what it means to be from Milwaukee, what it means to be from, you know, Athens. And I think that's a good thing. I think it needs to, with the mobility here. And I could actually even make it more complicated. If we just go back to a century from now, when we think about all these different "white ethnics." Right now, we say, you know, 80% white, etc. But thinking about Italians, Poles, Germans, you know, it's not like people thought of themselves as white back then, right? They do now, right? And so, thinking about those kinds of differences. But I think, when we think about migration, especially coming from Southern Europe, Africans have been migrating in significant numbers since the 1990s. So you have second, maybe even third generation. That challenges our idea of who is Spanish when we think about that, who is Greek. And so you could say that about Milwaukee or Wisconsin in general. The classes that I teach, I teach a class on the psychological effects of racism. And I have students who are of Latinx descent or who are biracial and coming from Green Bay or coming from Northern Wisconsin and talking about being the only person of color in their class and the challenges that they had. And at the same time, people don't see them as representing where they came from. And I tell them, you know what? That is a limitation, on that person defining you based on some limited perception that they have, right? Don't let that limit who you are and how you see yourself. Identity is fluid, identity changes, not only temporal, but place, etc. So I think it's just challenged us all to think differently, and that's a good thing.

Mallory Cheng: And Giannis has also spoken, too, about the multitudes of his identity and the ways that he moves throughout Greek culture, Nigerian culture, American culture. So I just want to ask this, too. What does that say about where we're moving as a country, where we have all these multitudes of identity and space?

Ermitte Saint Jacques: Here you have someone, for example, Giannis, right? He moves through a Greek cultural space. He moves though a Nigerian cultural space. We can think about Igbo, Yoruba. He is here in the U.S. and definitely moving within an African-American, a Black space. And thinking about his partner, his children, and how that adds also to the diversity, right? I think that, you know, many of us move through different cultural spaces and fluidly. And sometimes there might be some tensions or, you know, conflict, but most of the time we do it. And it's not superficial. And I say this to say people seem to traverse these different spaces, and it's part of who they are. I am also an immigrant. My parents are from Haiti, and I grew up in South Florida. I came to the US when I was four years old. And I think that sparked my interest in migration and looking at cultural change and generational differences and change. We think about diaspora, and thinking about people abroad, I think about just my own history and how I can speak Haitian Creole, how I could speak English, how I feel these multiple identities. And sometimes there's a tension, just in terms of when I'm not accepted or people don't think of me as an American. And I'm like, "So what is it to be an American?" I'm a naturalized citizen. So I think those issues, what attracted me to these ideas and topics was my own personal history. Thinking about just having a hyphenated identity. I think of myself as Haitian-American. And that also includes being Black as well. And I say that because, when people see me, they see a Black woman. Here I am in Wisconsin. When I go South Florida, where I grew up, I'm very much immersed in an Haitian American culture, right? I'm speaking Haitian Creole with some English, you know, eating Haitian food, etc. Very Haitian diasporic experience. When I'm here in Milwaukee, where there are just a few Haitians, you know, I'm very much immersed in an African-American culture. We, in our own lives, individually, just move through these different cultural spaces. And it's part of who we are.

Joy Powers: Ermitte Saint Jacques is an assistant professor in the Department of African and African Diaspora Studies at UWM. She spoke with former Lake Effect Producer Mallory Cheng in 2021. Do you need some flexibility for when you listen? You can listen to Lake Effect on demand. Find it as a podcast, wherever you like to listen, to download and enjoy on the go. In about 20 minutes, we'll look at Summerfest's lineup for the weekend. But first, in honor of the official start of summer, we're exploring the iconic song, "Summertime," and its many iterations. That's coming up next on Lake Effect, on 89.7 WUWM, Milwaukee's NPR.

Joy Powers: You're listening to Lake Effect on 89.7 WUWM. I'm Joy Powers. This past weekend marked the official start of summer. To mark the occasion this week, we're exploring the classic song, "Summertime," from the opera, "Porgy and Bess," written by George Gershwin. There are countless renditions of "Summertime," making it one of the most covered songs of all time. Yesterday, we learned about the history of the song from opera singer and Milwaukee native, Jason McKinney. Today, WUWM's Maayan Silver is discussing some of the many versions of the song, with Milwaukee bandleader and arranger Dave Wake, and former WUWM reporter and jazz enthusiast Chuck Quirmbach.

Dave Wake: So, I'm a musician. I was raised in a family in a house of musicians. My father was a musician. There was always music being played, sung, being performed as a family at my house. And this song is just kind of synonymous with my youth. It's a very, very popular song.

Maayan Silver: My dad used to sing that song, used to sing "Summertime" to my brother and I when we were kids. Like, I have very strong memories of him just, like, sitting in the doorway and singing that song.

Dave Wake: Yeah, likewise. It does bring me right back to my childhood in a way, of that same thing: my mom or my dad singing it.

Maayan Silver: Yeah. Chuck, do you want to add anything?

Chuck Quirmbach: I would just say the song by Gershwin and DeBose Hayward is sort of a symbol of my personal growth. Learning of, as I got as a kid, Billy Stewart's version of "Summertime" and then going back and going to college and being taught about Billie Holiday and Miles Davis.

Maayan Silver: Gosh, there's so many places we could start. Well, I'll just surprise you guys. Here we go. [Music plays].

Dave Wake: Well, Paul Desmond's tone, you can pick it up. It's just so unmistakable. It's, he's got such a rich... Of the saxophones, alto's not my favorite. It has to be someone special. And you look at Paul Desmon and he embodies like, yeah, the way that alto saxophone should be played. He's just... His tone is so, so unbelievable.

Maayan Silver: And there's something so summer about it. Like, it's just so smooth. It's really good driving music because you never want to get mad at other drivers when you're listening to Paul Desmond. What's your take, Chuck?

Chuck Quirmbach: I had the great benefit of four semesters with Richard Davis, the UW-Madison jazz professor, also jazz professional, internationally known bassist. But I took four semesters of jazz appreciation, if you will, with him, where we learned about Desmond and the "West Coast Cool" and "East Coast Hot" and so on, and Desmond just embodies that "West Coast Cool."

Maayan Silver: Nice. Okay, cool. Then we've got another one of your picks, Chuck. We've got this. [Music plays]. What do you think?

Dave Wake: Well, obviously, Miles. It's got that tone, that muted Miles tone. It's funny because that is like, that's the "East Coast Cool." It could be. I mean, it just like, his tone is so buttery. And one of the most amazing things about this recording in particular is you listen to those backing horns. Just the way they're shaped, just the way that the arrangement's shaped, with this right out front Miles horn. And then in the background you get these really soothing, calming, harmonized horns that are just kind of laying right in that mix. You got that ride cymbal, it just kind holds everything together, and right in that little box is these backing horns. It's a beautiful recording, beautiful arrangement.

Maayan Silver: Almost the percussion is, like... It's right there almost taking more attention than the horns even.

Dave Wake: Yeah, totally.

Chuck Quirmbach: I mean, the genius of Davis and Gil Evans, who worked with Davis on this album, just the way the song lends itself to so many different interpretations and so many good ones. And this, it was a classic, and we should mention that we are talking about this as about the 100th anniversary of Miles Davis' birth. Well, something more to celebrate. Besides "Summertime," it's Miles Davis at 100, if you will.

Maayan Silver: That's very cool. Okay, these are some more deep cuts, in the jazz realm, of "Summertime." This is one from Avishai Cohen.

Music: Summertime and the livin' is easy. Fish are jumping, ooh, when the cotton is high...

Maayan Silver: What's the musician's ear say about this one?

Dave Wake: Obviously, the task of a musician covering a song that's so popular or something that's so well known is trying to do your own take on it. Melodically, it's very true to the original song, but then everything going on with the rhythm section is kind of reinventing it, which is really interesting.

Music: You're gonna rise up singing...

Maayan Silver: And Avishai Cohen, he's a bass player, first and foremost. I mean, I think he was singing there. I'm not sure if it was him, but the bass line in that is very pronounced.

Chuck Quirmbach: I could be mistaken, but I hear the Israeli influence, the Middle Eastern influence in his performance of that. It really adds something.

Maayan Silver: Yeah. There's one more jazz version that I want you to hear. This is by a guy named Yaron Herman. [Music]. Very delicate. What do you think? It was like basically one guy on piano.

Dave Wake: Yeah, just solo piano. So, yeah, much like in the Avishai Cohen version where he pushed the limits with the rhythm section and kind of kept the thing, this is complete reharmonization using the melody and then... And you can really hear the influences. What's this artist's name again?

Maayan Silver: Yaron Herman.

Dave Wake: Yaron Herman. Yeah, you can hear influences. I mean, you hear Oscar Peterson, you can here Earl Gardner, you could hear the old, you know, almost in the stride stuff even, but it's just those big, those chords where he's really just, the big voicings where he is rolling them out. And then these re-harmonizations that are like reminiscent of like Ahmad Jamal, Keith Jarrett, you know, bringing a lot of influences into a very unique, super interesting version for sure.

Maayan Silver: And it's hearkening back to almost the essence of the song, the melody itself, because it's this very emotionally soft thing.

Dave Wake: Yep, lullaby, totally. Lullaby.

Chuck Quirmbach: It's the sort of song I like to listen to in the very early morning of a soft summer day or the very late evening of a soft summer evening.

Maayan Silver: Nice. Well, Dave, you had a bunch of nice deep cuts from really great stuff. I love this B.B. Seton's "Summertime."

Dave Wake: Yeah, that one's really good.

Music: Summertime...

Maayan Silver: What do you think?

Dave Wake: I mean, it's such, I mean it's great, that bass line drives it so nicely. And it's that kind of crooner, that Jamaican crooner era where there's this really great singer. Again, and socioeconomically, the nature of the song in Jamaica and music, very happy music and kind of in a place that is, you know, is rife with poverty and inequity and stuff like that, and having a song that sort of straddles those two worlds, it's poignant. There's quite a few reggae versions of this song, but yeah, it's just, it's a beautiful version for sure.

Chuck Quirmbach: Continues my lifelong education in music. I had never heard of a Jamaican or reggae version of this before, and it's beautiful.

Maayan Silver: Definitely. This is Lake Effect. I'm Maayan Silver, speaking with Dave Wake and Chuck Quirmbach about the epic and much reinvented song, "Summertime." On that note of just interesting versions. This is a Sarah Vaughan UFO remix. [Music].

Dave Wake: That's gorgeous.

Chuck Quirmbach: The genius of Sarah Vaughan endures, and with a modern twist.

Maayan Silver: Nice.

Dave Wake: I love the strings on that version. They're so good. It brings you right back, yeah. But no, that is the kind of electronic music I do like. I mean, it's like some of the faster house stuff... But that stuff, like that's the slow downtempo stuff where it really is, yeah, it really kind of ties in, connects the samples it's using to the kind of modern stuff.

Maayan Silver: Yeah. A little drum and bass almost?

Dave Wake: Yeah, a little. And yeah, again, the dub influence that we were talking about before.

Maayan Silver: There's some great, like, Latin jazz versions of this. So Dave, you had submitted one of them by Mongo Santamaría. Here we go.

Dave Wake: You got that guiro in there, the cha-cha bell. But this one's a variation. [Vocalizes]. It's got a little variation bell. So I mean, obviously, at the time of Mongo Santamaría, it was like, you have the rules of those rhythms. And then, when creatives get ahold of them, it's all about what Herbie Hancock... I was seeing him in concert a couple years ago, and he said, "I love when I learn new rules, so I can break them."

Chuck Quirmbach: Mongo Santamaría being from Cuba. Nothing says year-round summertime like Cuba.

Maayan Silver: Exactly, yes indeed. And then we're jumping over to Ray Barretto. Here we go. Do you know this version?

Dave Wake: I'm not sure if I do.

Maayan Silver: Alright, I love stumping Dave. Here we go. [Music].

Dave Wake: That's beautiful. I love the pizzicato coming from like the violin or whatever is going on. Like, just underneath it. [Vocalizes]. And then strings. Yeah, that's beautiful. That's very much cha-cha. But yeah, it's gorgeous

Maayan Silver: First of all, which one of these tracks do you think you'll be jamming the most this summer? And what are you most looking forward to in the summer?

Dave Wake: I mean that Ray Beretto version has been really nice. I want to dig into that deeper. You know, it's reminding me, too, of just like a real quick side note: just all the amazing like Sarah Vaughn, Billie Holiday. You know, there's so many good versions, from like Mahalia Jackson.

Maayan Silver: Ella Fitzgerald.

Dave Wake: I mean there's Ella's version. It's these great, iconic American, women singers that are kind of, very much defined this song. It's got this very much... This quality of sort of like your mother singing it to you, like a lullaby, you know? And so it just reminds me of visiting those on a summer night, like, Chuck, you were saying about listening to that piano music, like either like at the end of a long summer day, at the beginning in the morning. It's like stuff like that. It's such a good feeling of summer. You know, especially with the long, with the early sunrises and the late sunsets. Yeah, you know, something that just brings out... There's nothing like a summer thunderstorm. Like the smell of the rain when it first hits and stuff like that. That just sort of like... And again, it embodies all the melancholia and the fact that it's life-giving water coming. So it's sort of, much like the song, it's kind of all of it wrapped up into one for me. I really do love those moments in summer, like right before when you're watching a storm rolling in and then it kind of hits.

Maayan Silver: Poetry. Nice.

Chuck Quirmbach: For me "Summertime" is the greater daylight, and finding shade when you need it.

Maayan Silver: You're a big bicyclist.

Chuck Quirmbach: A little bit, and yeah, knowing the routes that are a little shadier, going through a green sort of canopy, then back out into the sunshine, then hopefully a little bit more shade down the way, it's a nice combination. But yeah, the nicer temperatures, fewer layers that you're wearing and so on, just being out in it, and the song is a perfect accompaniment to it.

Maayan Silver: And for a bonus take, we listen to Chuck's favorite version. Okay, Chuck, I actually don't have your version. Tell me again, Billy? Tell me again.

Chuck Quirmbach: Stewart. S-T-E-W-A-R-T.

Music: Summertime, and the livin' is easy.

Maayan Silver: Oh, of course. Yes, the true student of the 60s, yes.

Chuck Quirmbach: Yeah, this is the 60th anniversary of that song, and I heard it on the radio back... Either WOKY, WRIT, one of the commercial stations playing rock in the '60s. And it's just like, there's certain songs, there's certain versions where the non-musician like me just has to stop and say, "What did I just hear? I need to hear it again." I mean, much easier these days than asking a DJ to play it again 60 years ago, although they did that occasionally. But just the, "I need to hear that again," because it was so cool.

Dave Wake: Yeah, that's it. And it's kind of like... It's slightly different, but like, in the feeling it gives you, The Zombies' version of it is just much more... This is much more instrumentally driven, but it's like, it sort of... And it kind of dates it in the best way, too, when you hear that. It kind of just, it puts a time and place of like an era that just comes out in The Zombies' version. It's just so cool. Like you said, it's just, that is a great version.

Maayan Silver: Yes, well, we're closing the books on "Summertime." I mean, I guess it's just getting started, but our discussion of the song "Summertime" is now closed.

Dave Wake: It's excellent. May it inspire further deep digs on it, because there is so much. I mean, we could barely touch on even a small part of how much is going on with the legacy of this song. So that's maybe one of the more interesting points about it. It's just. It's a deep dive.

Maayan Silver: Yes.

Chuck Quirmbach: I was going to say, if you're an older person, hopefully the discussion prompts you to go back and find some of these versions. If you're a younger person, go back anyway and learn something, and, as I say, take it a different direction if you are a musician or even just a music fan.

Maayan Silver: Chuck and Dave, thank you so much for sitting around and talking to me about "Summertime."

Dave Wake: Thank you, Maayan.

Chuck Quirmbach: Thank you.

Joy Powers: That was Milwaukee keyboardist, bandleader, and arranger Dave Wake, and former WUWM Reporter Chuck Quirmbach, speaking with Maayan Silver. When we come back, we'll share some Summerfest recommendations from our friends at 88.9 Radio Milwaukee. That's next on Lake Effect, on 89.7 WUWM, Milwaukee's NPR.

Joy Powers: This is Lake Effect on 89.7 WUWM. I'm Joy Powers. Summerfest kicked off last weekend, and the second week of the festival begins tomorrow. To help you plan for this weekend of Summerfest, our friends at Radio Milwaukee are here to share their recommendations. Element Everest-Blanks and Jon Adler join Lake Effect's Audrey Nowakowski to talk about the music and what sets Summerfest apart from other music festivals.

Audrey Nowakowski: So we're coming up on week two of Summer Fest, and you're here to rep the Radio Milwaukee recommendations. And Element, let's start with you. What are you most looking forward to for this weekend's shows?

Element Everest-Blanks: There is so much great music that is coming to Summerfest that you can actually hear on HYFIN, which, for me, is very exciting, because we don't get a lot of the HYFIN artists that come here. We are one of those canaries in a coal mine. So, you know, if you hear it on HYFIN, all of a sudden two years later, now they're the biggest stars in the world. So it's exciting to have these artists that are a part of our new music discovery platform to actually be at Summerfest this year.

Audrey Nowakowski: Absolutely, and we're gonna get into some of the artists a little more in-depth. But for your quick hit recommendations, where should people start, let's say? Let's start with Thursday the 25th.

Element Everest-Blanks: Thursday the 25th, you gotta start with Robert Randolph. He is one of those artists that is so universally loved, because he's a great musician and a perfect example of an artist that blends genres.

Element Everest-Blanks: He's gospel, he's blues, he is funk. He's worked with so many different artists like Dave Matthews, all the way through Beyoncé. You gotta give some love, Midwest love, to Common who's coming here. Common is one of those artists that we used to see quite a bit at Summerfest, so it's nice to have him back. You gotta show these young hip hop artists the shoulders they're standing on. Common is great. We got Big Daddy Kane. When we're talking about legendary hip hop artists... Jon Adler's smile just went through the roof, because we both understand the level of Big Daddy Kane's lift when hip hop was founded. So all of these grandchildren of his are running around making hip hop music, and now you get to see the source.

Element Everest-Blanks: And then Milwaukee's own, Gem, Gemini Gilly, who we get to work with every day, John.

Jon Adler: Yes, all the time.

Element Everest-Blanks: She is one of those DJs that we are lucky to have, that we don't realize is a real gift to the Midwest. And she travels so much, because people understand she is a jewel, she is a gem, and we get work with her every single day. So she's gonna set a party off on the 25th of June.

Audrey Nowakowski: Incredible. And for Friday the 26th, a few acts you're thinking to keep an eye out for?

Element Everest-Blanks: It is all about having fun on the 26th. You got Sudan Archives, which is an artist that never likes to stay on stage. She's infamous for jumping out into the audience, you know, playing her violin upside down, or doing the splits in the middle of the crowd and dancing with them.

Element Everest-Blanks: She is a fun artist to watch. She is like going to an actual show. It's not a recording artist coming to your city to perform. She is performer. So you gotta be in the building for Sudan Archives. Mr. Mondo, DJ New York, they're gonna keep you dancing as well. I've seen DJ New York, so you'll never be bored whenever you see his name on the bill.

Audrey Nowakowski: Which is great. And then Saturday the 27th?

Element Everest-Blanks: Oh my goodness. PawPaw Rod, he is a global sensation, right John?

Jon Adler: We are playing him and he's so much fun, so much in one song. So the stage, I cannot wait. I cannot for the stage performance.

Element Everest-Blanks: Yes, and Jean Dawson, he is one of those universal artists, as well, that blends genres. His mother is Mexican-American. His father is African-American. So he's always lived between these two worlds. And he is a perfect example of an artist that does not think about genres. They just make the music they make, and their audience will continue to follow.

Element Everest-Blanks: He is a punk, hip hop, rock, indie/alt, but also very smooth and sensitive type of artist. And then you have Milwaukee's own King Solomon. And this group is so legendary that they were one of the groups I looked up to when I was growing up as an artist in the city, and they're still making incredible music after all these years, after some of the losses that they sustained, that music kept moving. And they are a perfect example of how Milwaukee... When you have a foundational group that helps create the soundtrack of your city, it never really goes away. We always honor them and we'll be honoring them this year at Summerfest.

Audrey Nowakowski: And John, going to your recommendations, what are some quick hits you'd recommend for Thursday?

Jon Adler: Thursday, 10 p.m., the band Kaleo, an Icelandic band. Gonna be playing Miller Lite Oasis. Just years and years of hits and hits, no dip in their career. They've been in Milwaukee several times. Old 97s, and time economy is a big thing with Summerfest. I know you go to a show, and you kind of unplug, and you don't think about time. Summerfest is a little bit of a different animal because where things are located on your schedule is really important. So the fact that Old 97s, who have been around for 30 plus years, are playing at 5:15, which... I think they know their crowd.

Audrey Nowakowski: They're coming early.

Jon Adler: The Mountain Goats also on Thursday night at the Aurora Pavilion at 7 p.m. And finally, Thursday, a Chicago band called Sincere Engineer, a beautiful, hardworking DIY band, kind of a punk, kind of rock.

Jon Adler: And I looked at the rest of their tour schedule, and it is just day after day after day. They get in the van, they go to the next city, and that's the kind of thing you love. So I'm guessing a band like that that's close to home will kind of love being practically a home show. Friday night, it's get all your friends from the late 90s and 2000s together and go see Goldfinger at 10.30 p.m. at the Miller Lite Oasis. Oh, there'll be two or three sing-alongs. You'll see your old high school locker mate possibly. What happened to her? What happened to him?

Audrey Nowakowski: All the "Smallwaukee."

Jon Adler: All the "Smallwaukee" is back. A beautiful band, The Revivalists, out of New Orleans, are playing at 9:30, Uline Warehouse. A wonderful band. Lead singer does his solo stuff, but as a band they are huge. I think there's seven or eight pieces altogether, and it is a very New Orleans feel to it.

Jon Adler: They take the whole stage. They do not stay in one place they are out there. It is a party. It is what you want a festival to be, which I love. Big Wild as well, playing Generac Power stage at 7:30 on Friday, is going to be a blast, simply put. No more adjectives. And then Saturday, great Milwaukee band, Fuzzysurf, playing early, 2:30 at the Briggs and Stratton Big Backyard Stage. A fun, kind of almost "nerd rock" band. They make some of the most creative videos, and I realize you're not going there to see videos, but they're also... They know the stage presence. It's more than just music.

Jon Adler: It is a, kind of a full experience. And I love getting, again, the Milwaukee talent front and center. I know there's always conversations about, "What if there's a local stage?" No. I want them butted up against national acts, so these national acts go, "What are you guys doing next year? Would you want to open for us again? Yeah." That's how friendships are made. That's how the business kind of works, which is kind of fun and insane. Another, such a talented artist Vincent Van Great. Milwaukee artist, 2:30 p.m. I'm so glad he's at the T-Mobile stage, a big stage for a guy with even bigger talent. So that would be my three day break down there.

Audrey Nowakowski: Awesome, and then one artist that you're particularly excited about is Kim Gordon. And this will be their first Milwaukee show solo, right?

Jon Adler: Correct. Thursday night, Briggs and Stratton Big Backyard stage at 10 p.m. Her first Milwaukee show. She obviously was part of Sonic Youth and has been at a high level for a long time. But again, an artist that... She graduated from art school first, moved from LA to New York, started Sonic Youth with her husband, now ex-husband Thurston Moore. She's a fashion icon, she is musically incredible.

Jon Adler: But last year, she only played nine shows. Only two were in the States. Before that, I think she only played 40 or 50 shows. Before that, three or four years of only doing less than 10 shows. So, to say this is a unique and great get for Summerfest, it's huge. It's enormous. And she has a brand new album, came out in March, which is incredible, called "Play Me." So I'm very much looking forward to seeing her, like everybody, probably for the first time.

Audrey Nowakowski: Yeah, and now, you know, music is obviously the draw for the big gig, but there's so many things about the grounds, the culture, the people, that make it another memorable experience. So we're going to go over some some of your favorite things that are about Summerfest that aren't revolving around music. So, Element, let's start with you.

Element Everest-Blanks: Well, one of the things that I absolutely love is although it's not music related to signing bands or platforming our traditional local bands or touring artists, is Grace Weber's Music Lab. You know, we have this incubator for growing musicians here in Milwaukee, through the Radio Milwaukee brand, for high school students. And they will be performing at the AmFam stage.

Audrey Nowakowski: Incredible.

Element Everest-Blanks: Yes, on July 2nd. So I am so excited that Grace Weber's Music Lab has brought these budding new artists to Summerfest. And what does that say about your level of talent? If you are a high school student and your first gig is the world's biggest music festival, that says a lot, and that gives you a boost of confidence that you can only get by playing Summerfest. The second thing I'm really excited about: as a mom, one of the fun things I love to do when I go to Summerfest is take my twin sons. And one of coolest things we've ever done at Summerfest was this fire station bus, or this truck, where they taught them about fire safety. So even though Summerfest is the biggest music festival, and we're doing all these things centering music, there's still this aspect of responsibility in our community that kids have access to and learn about through this wonderful music festival. And as a mom, I'm appreciative of that.

Audrey Nowakowski: Yeah, and it's important that it's good for the whole family and people of all ages. I remember my mom taking us on the kids' days and, you know, they have playgrounds for people. Like, even if you just want to get out and have a nice change of scenery and play at the lakefront, like, there's something for everybody there.

Element Everest-Blanks: You can become a kid again, right here in our city.

Audrey Nowakowski: Yes, well, and John, in being a kid again, I would need to muster up some courage to go back on the sky glider. But that's your recommendation, right?

Jon Adler: I have a terrifying fear of heights.

Audrey Nowakowski: But you're recommending skydiving.

Jon Adler: Terrifying fear of heights. I explained it to my wife several years ago before we even got married. She goes, "You keep on saying you're afraid of heights, but you always go on the sky glider." I go, "I also have a terrifying fear of snakes, but if I met a snake, and I knew its name, and I knew it never bit anybody, that's the snake I'd like." Sky glider is the one fear of heights that has... It's the asterisk in my fear of heights. Internally, I just shut down. I just breathe in, breathe out, the way you do in a yoga class, except my legs are dangling, and I smell whatever is cooking below me. And sometimes it stops. And that's the fun part. It is very much like life. It's usually a nice, smooth transition, but when it hits, you swing a little bit, you go, hey, everything's going to be fine. Somebody must have not gotten off right, or gotten on right. Everything's gonna be cool. In the meantime, let's see what stage we're going to next. So it's function. It's fashion, because you could lose a flip-flop and there are several that you can. But skyglide is the only... It's my fear-conquering mode of transportation, and it's the greatest way to get from A to B. I'll do it four, three times, usually, in an evening. It's how I get there. And I love people watching, but I'd rather watch people from the tops of their heads.

Audrey Nowakowski: Love it. Great take. And John and Element, thank you both so much for joining me today to share your Summerfest recommendations.

Jon Adler: Thank you.

Audrey Nowakowski: And we'll probably see you at the grounds.

Element Everest-Blanks: Yeah you will. Or you'll see us looking down at you.

Jon Adler: Yeah, I'll see you.

Audrey Nowakowski: I'll wave to you in the skyglider.

Joy Powers: Element Everest-Blanks is the program director at HYFIN, and Jon Adler is the assistant program director at Radio Milwaukee. They spoke with Lake Effect's Audrey Nowakowski about this upcoming weekend of Summerfest. And that wraps up today's show. Thank you so much for being here with us. I'm Joy Powers. If you missed any of Lake Effect this week, you can find all of our conversations at wuwm.com. If you'd like to take the show on the go, you can download the Lake Effect Podcast wherever you get your podcasts. Tomorrow on Lake Effect, we'll learn about an event in the 1950s, when millions of frogs invaded a small Wisconsin town. Plus, in a new Chirp Chat, we'll about barn swallows and the unique homes they have on the bluffs of Lake Michigan. Thanks so much for joining us right here on listener-supported 89.7 WUWM, Milwaukee's NPR.