Slogans like "abolish ICE" or "defund the police (or prisons)" have a lot of weight behind them. In Milwaukee, these calls have become more commonplace over the past decade – especially during the city’s budget season. And recently, they’ve been used against politicians who’ve once shared those sentiments.
But what do they mean to organizers in Milwaukee who fight for systemic change every day?
“A little over…15 years ago, police abolition has become more — I don't know if mainstream is the right way to call it — but definitely a bigger talking point,” says Alan Chavoya, an organizer with Milwaukee’s Alliance Against Racist and Political Repression. “And then defund, it became much more popular in the wave of the Ferguson uprising.”
Chavoya says something that’s lost in people’s critiques of these movements is that there’s a difference between abolition and defunding. Chavoya says abolition is a framework, where defunding police is a practical tactic.
Chavoya’s call isn’t for abolition, but community control over the police.
“Basically in a community, it gets a democratic say and direct say in how the police function in their community — if they function at all,” he says.
In Milwaukee there’s the Fire and Police Commission. But Chavoya points out two issues with our system: first, the commission is appointed by the mayor, not the community, so members might not have any history pushing for police accountability. And second, post-Act 12, the commission doesn't make policy for the department, but is essentially in an advisory role.
There is a version of this kind of community control happening not too far away, in Chicago. The pilot program is called CCPSA – the Community Commission for Public Safety and Accountability. While there are kinks to work out, there has been a lot more community involvement around policing — which shows promise, Chavoya says.
When it comes to full out abolition of police, he’s got questions. How would it work? Who would wield the power to do the abolition?
“And, how do you reconcile with people, like, in the community who don't want to get rid of the police?” Chavoya asks. “That's a question that I think is very important, because when we do go and talk with people, you know, everyday people, they'll sometimes say stuff like, 'Well, we want more police.'”
“We currently spend, you know, over 40% of our budget on police to produce safety, and yet bad things still happen,” Devin Anderson, an organizer with the African American Roundtable, says. “And a lot of them.”
That conversation Chavoya was talking about — Anderson has conversations like this regularly. He remembers talking to an older woman who wanted more police on her block.
“Because people broke into her house, and then as we continued the conversation, it was revealed that actually the police never showed up to support,” he says. “But actually neighbors helped to support by boarding her windows and then eventually replacing it with a new window.”
The African American Roundtable has pushed for a form of defunding, or reallocating resources – participatory budgeting. This is when residents get to decide a portion of our city’s budget.
“It's going to invite people to think about what would make their neighborhood safer that isn't police,” Anderson says. “And how can we go about making that happen? We see this useful in the efforts to move resources away as a proof of concept.”
What they learned is that residents wanted to spend less money on policing and more on housing, jobs, resources and opportunities for young people.
But people know this word is divisive. It’s been used to attack gubernatorial candidates like Francesa Hong on past statements. And even people who have been system-impacted, or formerly incarcerated, know these words hold a lot of weight, and won’t use them.
“I think what many of my remarks over the years have conveyed, without me necessarily saying defund or abolish prisons, is basically if we want safer communities, we have to invest in people,” says Sean Wilson, a director at Dream.org. “That accountability matters, but so does opportunities, so does treatment, housing and a successful reentry.”
Wilson has been working on criminal justice reform policy pretty much since his release from prison 15 years ago. He doesn’t get caught up in words, but more in how the state spends our resources.
“The prison system budget is more than the entire UW system,” says Wilson. “And so if our Department of Corrections budget is larger than the educational institution in our state…it should also tell Wisconsinites where we are placing our priorities.”
In the latest state budget from 2025-2027, the UW system received an increase of over $250 million. Meanwhile, corrections received over $520 million, and hundreds of new jobs.
While Wilson doesn’t use words like defund or abolition, he has a critique of our budgets, both city and state. And he thinks our priorities — spending so much on police and prisons — are all wrong.
“That is not going to exacerbate the problem, but that's going to improve not only the lives of the individuals who are perpetrating these acts, but it's also going to improve the lives of the communities in which these folks are coming from who are perpetrating these acts,” Wilson says.
A lot of this comes back to the idea of “public safety.” For people like Devin Anderson, public safety isn’t about policing, but collective safety — which is different.
“What keeps us most safe is having a well-rounded community and well-resourced community where people of all ages can see themselves and have places to go, play, explore and just enjoy life together,” says Anderson.
